Jul 16, 2013 11:20 PM

OH OF COURSE...

but mostly so I can make fun of you :P

Bah. Wouldn't expect anything else. Even though your hilarious commentary would be great, haha, if someone is willing to work one on one. That would be perfect. Instead of posting all the nitty gritty on here. No reason to bog down the page.

Would not the Signer AND Co-Signer have to do the same. As the primary signer defaults the debt is transfered to the Co-signer leaving them in the same position.?

Chad Brodgesell gets it. Th OTHER SURETY (Co-signer) MUST consent.

Chad - thats actually what I was thinking

Thank Scott Duncan. My knowledge is from him. Well what little I have so far.

What process are u using to discharge the debt?

Best thing is when a third party decides to buy the debt

I WILL do "private work, but I demand value for my time...

If you are male, then you'd best negotiate a currency exchange, and I get paid UP FRONT. Alternate'y, you may offer up your wife/daughter/mother to work off on their backs.

If you are female, you may offer up yourself and/or wife/daughter/mother to work off the debt on your/their back.

Why is that Pete?

Todd - Im using the following. http://www.mindwarpsectorfour.com/creditcard.html

Wait. This is a COLLECTION AGENCY!

Because, when a third party decide to BUY the debt guess what happen......the debt is THEIR'S lol....:-D

Why didn't you SAY so? :D The DEBT IS DISCHARGED

You had a contract with the BANK. They sold it. Not your business anymore. To put it in simple terms.

I know, I got a call from one today. Love chatting with him. Finally he said, "this conversation is going nowhere", I said, "what are you talking about, its going perfect, exactly the way I want it to go"

If it hasn't to this point been sold to a third party, and one decide to send letters to discharge - which Im trying to work on. To whom would you send them? I asked the bank for contact info for the CFO - the guy actually laughed at me. And told me to contact the Ombudsman? Would this be correct.

Scott -Why didn't you SAY so? The DEBT IS DISCHARGED? ......What do you mean.

I mean you are a girl-brain who can't read. :P

This letter is from a COLLECTION AGENCY. YOU DON'T OWE THE BANK ANYTHING!

THE BANK SOLD THE DEBT! IT'S NOT THEIRS ANYMORE.

and you have no contract with them unless you agree to contract with them (the collection agency)

Yes. Can I assume you did not sign a contract with "Baycorp"?

Yes. I get that. I knew that before. Just confirming.

would the bank or the collection agency or both try to hit her credit rating?

Those are not my letters, which Im sure your boy-brain understands. Thats just the process Im looking at using. So basically, why even do that? Just walk away - wait for the bank to sell it to a third party - and it no longer even exists since I never contracted with the third party.

Pretty much. Yes.

Peter Mansfield is awesome at dealing with "collection agents". Pity he's never on.

I contracted with the bank to clear some debt...they cashed my check confirming their agreement to my offer but haven't responded to any of my correspondence at all..nor called me when their monthly payment was returned because of a stop payment I put on my account.

Your part is done. why would they call?

last time I checked there was still a balance...I guess I expected them to call and try to trap me

As far as I'm concerned I am grateful they accepted my contract offer and I no longer owe them :)

If the Collection Agency calls you tell them to send you a claim from to you signed. Add if they continue to harass you with out claim then you will bill them $1000.00 (insert currency here) per incident also inform them that if they affect your credit rating in anyway with out claim then they will incur a $1,000,000.00 (insert currency here) to be paid forth with to your currant address. Also tell them that this conversation is being recorded and will constitute your terms if they want to discuss any thing with you.

I also have a contract opportunity for those who may want to hit my credit rating...on my credit report I have a note, stating that without having proof a lawful contract with me, they agree to pay me well for that opportunity to hit it

Is that the same with any third party ie solicitor firm ?. I had one contact me today demanding payment on a parking ticket or go to court. As it will be me vs the county council I'm assuming there is a difference

There is. they haven't sold the debt.

Cool. I was going to contact the most senior member of the firm and ask him is he going to take responsibility for this notice and to provide full disclosure on how to discharge the debt as i know they won't but that is pointless too in this instance yes ?

As it not a signed bill i cannot pay so go to court and notice of mistake should do the trick.

do you even have to go to court...can't you just send the notice of mistake?

Ye was thinking that just as i posted that return the letter with a notice attached

NO RETURN ADDRESS. DO NOT PUT A RETURN ADDRESS AND SEND REGISTERED.

The lady at the post office said YOU HAVE TO PUT A RETURN ADDRESS, I sad why?, she said WELL, and the discusion ended...

if you must...put the return address as the address where you are sending it :P

They don't make you fill in a return address over here :)

Should i put a big red void stamp across their notice for an added fuck you ?

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PUT A RETURN ADDRESS ON REGISTERED MAIL ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD!

Just in case you missed it:

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PUT A RETURN ADDRESS ON REGISTERED MAIL ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD!

For the Christians, because they're stupid:

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PUT A RETURN ADDRESS ON REGISTERED MAIL ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD!

ANYONE CLAIMING OTHERWISE, IS LYING TO YOU!

Which law is that then? :D

Prove it. Show me the law.

:D

Government workers are the best to do that with. :D

"Well, since you work for the government, I will concede that it is most reasonable to presume that YOU are more familiar with the rules, than I am... Except that you work for the government... You make a living being a lying parasite. It is reasonable to assume that you haven't STOPPED being a lying parasite just for me! I shall presume you are lying. Show me this law and how I am bound to it!"

Damn , I want to use that.

And when you finish saying all this, you VOID the fucker :-D

Gail 'I also have a contract opportunity for those who may want to hit my credit rating...on my credit report I have a note, stating that without having proof a lawful contract with me, they agree to pay me well for that opportunity to hit it'.... How did you go about that, if you don't mind me asking?

ChiefRock Sino General helped me with it....2 pieces of ID (1 with picture) and any bill with your name and address on it...send a copy of those along with your contract offer to the credit bureau with instructions to attach the contract offer to my account

How would you go about wording something like that? That would be great to get more information on that. If Im understanding it correctly, if you send that to the credit bureau - your credit it protected. Unless you personally default on a payment of whatever, for example. But a third party can't touch it, since there is no contract. Correct? Or am I girl-braining it...

Collection agencies have NO authority to "hit your credit rating".

if, you accept registered mail from a collection agency, with a filed claim inside, have you dumbwittingly contracted?

No collection agency in the history of the universe has ever sent registered mail to ANYBODY they DON'T ALREADY HAVE a contract with.

Who lied to you and said they recieved registered mail from a collection agency? (And yes they are lying)

Collection agencies need a CONTRACT to claim.

Ok, NONE of the shit you people are spewing is true. Seriously. Time to shut up now.

TO REVIEW:

NO COLLECTION AGENCY DOES, and NOR CAN THEY DO, ANY OF THE FOLLOWING:

1: Report ANYTHING to a CREDIT REPORTING AGENCY - Anything they reported would be FRAUD, as there's NO FUCKING CONTRACT

2: FILE LEGAL CLAIMS - AGAIN, NO FUCKING CONTRACT. Did you receive a BENEFIT from them? Are they an INJURED PARTY?

Seriously. Stop making shit up. The REAL stuff is hard enough, with out having to clean up YOUR made-up shit!

Does ANYBODY know what the phrase "SOLD A BILL OF GOODS" means?

The drawer is liable and the drawee only liable once the bill is presented for acceptance and he accepts the obligation by signing the bill forming contract otherwise the bill has no value until it is accepted

No Gail. Being sold a lie is being sold a lie. Being sold a bill of goods is something else.

It means the buyer was fooled

To sell a bill of goods today usually means 'to put something over on someone'. This usage appears to have arisen in the 1920s. No one knows exactly how it got started; but as long as there have been commercial transactions there has been fraud, so the association of the two in this phrase apparently struck a chord. Inducing people to order a bill of goods by exaggerating their quality, and even taking money for goods that never materialize at all, are familiar concepts, as centuries of court records attest. In a rather colorful example, a 1949 case in the North Carolina Supreme Court concerned a textile mill's complaint that it had been fraudulently induced to purchase a bill of goods including an item for 148,227 pounds of dyed cotton, only to find "that 100 bales of said merchandise . . . was not dyed cotton but was of a quality greatly inferior, which was known as dyed waste or 'frog hair', as the defendants then well knew."

Although bill of goods in the current sense of 'something fraudulent, deceptive, exaggerated' is usually associated with the verb sell, it is often used alone. A recent law review article about proposed "patient bill of rights" legislation contains this example, which manages to wrap together several meanings of bill: "The bill of rights formulation has also allowed for further permutations--with Democrats deriding Republican proposals as a bill of goods and a bill of wrongs, and Republicans arguing that the Democrats' approach creates a lawyer's right to bill."

The COLLECTION AGENCY BOUGHT the bill of goods (the debt) and now has TITLE to the account.

However JOINDER MUST BE RE-ESTABLISHED with all parties on the bill. You contracted with the ORIGINAL secured party, not the agency.

The bill is still VALID if the other party ACCEPTS it.

The collection agency KNOWINGLY bought a "Bill of goods" to victimize the gullible parties.

Giving your name and address is enough for them to PRESUME joinder. They THEORETICALLY could lay a claim based on this. If they send it by registered mail.

Sending it back registered mail (RETURN EVERYTHING THEY SENT WITH A NOTICE OF MISTAKE) will kill it dead right there.

Watch what you say on phone calls. Shit like "we just need to confirm your address... What is your address"?

Speaking of which- has this Sterling Bailiff company ALSO bought this debt then from the City of Toronto and now has TITLE to the account, too?

Yes.

So a private-Bailiff-company is nothing more than a glorified Collection Agency?

Important to note: there is a BIG difference between a Baillff from a private-company, and, a Bailiff sent by the City SHERIFF

Heres another issue my friend just got hit with a lawsuit against him, for get this failure to pay. But they continue to take monthly paychecks.

He sent a letter asking questions and MAnuLife went apeshit.

Notice of mistake time for lawsuit?

I have a friend who has a brief NOTICE OF CONDITIONAL ACCEPTANCE he sends out:

"I conditionally-accept your demand for payment, on the condition upon presentment to me of the ORIGINAL INSTRUMENT OF INDEBTEDNESS in its ORIGINAL form."

..but im guessin' NOTICE OF MISTAKE trumps that, obviously

just curious on responses i could do up. this has a 20 day limit so gotta act fast.

Just in case you missed it:

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PUT A RETURN ADDRESS ON REGISTERED MAIL ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD! I know you said this three times and I'm shaking in my boots because I don't want to feel a tingly sensation Scott. But I'm so curious I have to ask. Shaking in boots with bloody shins. Here it goes: ChiefRock recently told me to put my Address on registered mail, but, instead of adding the last line (postal code) he told me to write: Non Domestic without Canada. Here's my questions: Did Chief Rock make a mistake instructing me to do this? Is this a valid option? Have we been misinformed?

What Joey Spirit said.

Whew! I was truly nervous asking that. :D

Mmm. So I gather that the POSTAL CODE *** IS *** the WARD (POLITICAL DISTRICT) there by use of the POSTAL CODE "DESIGNATES" you as a WARD of THEIR POLITICAL JURISDICTION.? ? Just thinking out loud.

Other wise why are you using it....insert at end

It's their internal accounting system.

Chad. If you put in the postal code. You are admitting/creating joinder. Essentially you are saying I'm a government of Canada employee and I am here as an employee working hard protecting/serving at this Canadian post (think military post) identified by these numbers and letters. That is my understanding.

I get it now. Was wondering because the postal codes seem to follow the ward boundaries from what I can see when I compare maps.

Postal Code = Postal Secret :D

I can't quite recall...perhaps two years ago, when I got into this, I seem to recall Winston Shrout saying AlLL postal codes throughout the world are registered with the IMF. Do I remember that accurately Scott? Or am I way off base?

It is the highest treaty. The mail ALWAYS runs. Even in war.

So yes. All postal codes are registered as a SURVEYED ACCOUNT.

First off how much do you owe ? Who is trying to collect ?

$400,000.00 Russian Mafia

:/

Here in the States, using a postal code is acquiescence to the Federal Jurisdiction. It is prima facie evidence that YOU have claimed DOMICILE in DC and are RESIDING in another State. I have sent thousands of pieces exactly like this:

John Doe 123 Main Street Peabody, Massachusetts

Some guys use [ ] around the Zip Code or write "Near", but it is not necessary. They way I write it is de jure and compliant with current Postage Regulation. ALL MY MAIL GETS WHERE I WANT IT TO!

Put "Non-Domestic" under the city/state line.

ate u saying that without the wording non domestic, it is presumed to be domestic?

They would presume as they have not been told otherwise.

What does any of these posts have to do with debt? She wants to be enlightened on how to deal with her debt...

So the best thing would be First off how much do you owe ? Who is trying to collect ? and I think you've asked that quetion to her ChiefRock Sino General....

Silence makes.... makes think there is none lol ...

Chad , they have been told otherwise...i didnt use code!

hmmmm.....

Yes , and part of dealing with debt is the paper work that does deal with it. This paper work requires entries and fields to be filled out. If I am out of line here on this then continue to Discuss law but never practice the actions of the law. I think Ashley would like to have the aspects, concepts AND the Practical information of dealing with her problem. Every Single Piece of it.

A post from Ashley With details would help her greatly.

As too Pete and ChiefRock Sino General question - I want to say I owe nothing to no one. But I owed around 10,000 to TD which I 'borrowed' for educational purposes.

Great, come on ChiefRock Sino General :D

i just had a collection agency call me. NO idea why they were calling, they would say that its a business matter and they would not talk until they confirm name D.O.B and address.

How convienient.

my question is, since collection agencies are KNOWN to be abusive and harrass how do you prevent them without giving your address out?

The other information on this post, brought to light different aspects that I hadn't taken into account or really thought of. So Im happy it came up, even if it doesn't really deal with debt.

LOL....if they don't have your address, why the heck they would contact you ? :D

i know right? the law that governs them states they MUST contact you by mail prior to calling you.

It's great when they trip over their own rules

COLLECTION AGENCY is a BUSINESS

They BUY debt, and try to re-sell DEBTS

That's ALL

Replace the word debt by toilet paper

Tell them this is a recorded call and if they continue to call thus number without providing proof of claim the per each instance they will incur a fee to be paid forthwith in Canadian funds by certified check.

Let say I BUY toilet paper, and I CALL you to sell it to you, and I'm rude with you because I THINK (in my fucked-up trainless head) that you have NO CHOICE of buying MY toilet paper :/

Since you said that Ashley Hamaluk, I'll just do this one comment off topic. This goes under your city/state line and keeps them from adding a zip code without your permission. You are citing their own postal manual

Non-Domestic, w/o the US ZIP EXEMPT (DMM 602 1.3e (1)(2))

They have to send you an invoice with stuff and/or services you've asked from them......that's it.

Ashley Hamaluk, are you at the COLLECTION AGENCY status as we speak ?

Be more specific Ashley Hamaluk, you, supposely, owe $$ to TD, is that correct ?

Its only been recently that I stopped paying off the TP. Since the bank HAS NONE of my contact information, how will I know the TP has been sold off to collections?

I don't believe I am. As I stated above, Pete

Well, that's easy, you call that bank to give them your contact information.

Why would I do that?

You WANT TO PAY, if, of course you owe.....NEVER hide from what you owe...YOU ALWAYS WANT TO PAY....ALWAYS

Because, you are respectful, honourable, integre and digne...(whatever these words in English may be ) :D

A question on adresses. Say I intend to form a private trust, can I use my existing home address for the trust and have it Non Domestic Without The United Kingdom effectively making it offshore?

Hey Bank, I'm here and I want to pay, there is only a very little problem though....I HAVE NO MONEY OF EXCHANGE AND NO MONEY OF ACCOUNT right now :/.....sorry

without

Sorry Bildo, that was a typo :-) Now edited to correct.

That bank, at one point, will try to find a sucker that will accept to BUY that debt

:D

So the BANK will lose NOTHING, because that MONEY never existed in the first place....in reality, the bank will make profit, no mather the price that sucker will pay for that DEBT

Im happy you said that - cause thats how I understood it.

Fuck !!!!!!!!!!!! :D, are you ok Ashley Hamaluk ?

You are happy to hear from me what you already knew in the first place ?......do you take pills ?

she has seen the same light at the end of the tunnel as you Pete Daoust

Fuck that !!! :/ I hate when people ask me a question when they already know the answers....and if they let me explaine in details, and at the end they say: oh I knew that !.....I go nuts with that shit :D

it's good confirmation ...you are still needed Pete Daoust

So keep on working discharging debt Ashley Hamaluk...!!! :D

Gail Blackman....

Fuck off :D

Lets say, someone decided to discharge the toilet paper via the letter way (as I posted a link too). Would that work? Has anyone tired? Or as stated not worth the effort.

understand what DISCHARGE and SETOFF means.

I'm in the process, of setting off some debt by contracting ...using an administrative process

Oh yeah, you stamp the toilet paper with ACCEPTED BY. and swing back this fucker to me....

We ALL have the "substantive right to set-off debt".

Cf. United States v. Munsey Trust Co., 332 U.S. 234, 239, 67 S.Ct. 1599, 1601, 91 L.Ed. 2022 (1947) ("government has the same right 'which belongs to every creditor, to apply the unappropriated moneys of his debtor, in his hands, in extinguishment of the debts due to him' " (quoting Gratiot v. United States, 40 U.S. (15 Pet.) 336, 370, 10 L.Ed. 759 (1841))); see also Tatelbaum v. United States, 10 Cl.Ct. 207, 210 (1986) (set-off right is inherent in the United States government and grounded on common law right of every creditor to set off debts)

Cf. De Magno v. United States, 636 F.2d 714, 727 (D.C. Cir. 1980) (district court had jurisdiction over claim involving VA’s “affirmative action against an individual whether by bringing an action to recover on an asserted claim or by proceeding on its common-law right of set-off”) (discussing similar language of predecessor statute, 38 U.S.C. — 211)

Step by Step for Ashley ( but I’m sure she already know that) :D

1). Call bank and give your address and EVERYTHING 2). Be honourable 3). You want to pay IF you owe, ALL THE TIME 4). You have your pockets and accounts EMPTY 5). But you REALLY want to pay. 6). Bank will ACTIVELY search for a sucker 7). Bank will FIND a sucker 8). Bank will make PROFIT from this sucker 9). Sucker will CALL you. 10). You tell the sucker to contact you via mail 11). You tell the sucker you want to pay IF you owe them. 12). But the sucker haven’t done and/or supply ANYTHING to you. 13). So you don’t owe NOTHING to that sucker. 14). So the sucker is the happy OWNER of of brand spanking OLD debt. 15). End of story.

:D

Insert Blood in front of sucker for a more graphic picture of what they look like.

Thank you Pete! And others for the insight and info.

They won't suck mine, I garantee that :D

But Ashley, you already knew all this, why thank us ? :/

Then collection agency sends you a claim stating: "Pursuant to the Conveyancing and Law of Property Act, the Original Creditor assigned the liability, including interest, to the Plaintiff on (date)" Lawyer advises that the collections agency doesn't require further joinder.

Lawyer advises ?......since when ? :/

What Plaintiff ?

Who is the "original creditor" named on the 1099? The originating one.

It,s 6pm here

What are you talking about ?

sounds like Brauns Orig Libau T?lis had an experience with a collection agency and this was the outcome?

I don't have ANY idea what he's talking about :/

Original creditor=Can Tire Financial Plaintiff=CONTACT RESOURCE SERVICES INC

and WHO are you in all this shit ?

defendant

send back the documents dont take surety

Lucky you :D

Return it all with a notice of mistake.

scott, can you give assistance to my lien thread that derek moran posted?

Some guidance is greatly appreciated.

:D

Do you pay up front or with your sister :D

my sister is 11 years old.....

:(

all i can do is share my experiences to others and encourage them to do the same.

my point was collections 'claim' they were assigned. www.canlii.org/en/on/laws/stat/rso-1990-c-c34/latest/rso-1990-c-c34.html

And who cares ? Brauns Orig Libau T?lis ( I will NEVER be able to remember your name :( )

and for many people who don't know any better that trick would work

That is a large essay. Tara Duncan is busy at the moment so my composition is crippled. I do the big ones when she's around. Don't expect anything until sunday.

I have good reasons to believe that this CONTACT RESSOURCES thing BOUGHT the debt....

large essay in relation to the collections or liens??or both??

Brauns Orig Libau T?lis, I mean the "Original Creditor". Alllll the way back in the chain.

The signature seals the deal, creates the account. Banks serve the creator and bill for their services.

Brauns Orig Libau T?lis, I would love to pay if they can substantiate their claim...after all I'm honourable and acting in good faith, so IF they 'claim' they were assigned the debt, THEN they must have the original document, in its' original form, signed by me.

I asked one of these collection companies for confirmation that if they had purchased the debt in question, they would have the original contract in their possession...otherwise that could be construed as fraud, coercion & harassment.

They said they were not proceeding with any claim until they investigated and could confirm that for me...that was more than two years ago, closer to 4, I stopped waiting for their confirmation.

Stuart Stone, that's lovely straight to the point conditional acceptance. I love ! :-)

Look up what a REMITTANCE is. Ask for ADVICE on the REMITTANCE ;)

A BILL or a SIGNED INVOICE will do.

if you ask for advice they will say "we accept cash credit card cheque etc"

Now you can do as I said before and LOOK UP THE WORD "REMITTANCE".

Remittance IS advice. It is ONLY found on a BILL or a SIGNED INVOICE.

What is it you are saying Scott ? (I really don't get it )....and as you know, if I don't get it, no one will....

Never mind Scott, it just became clear in my brain... :-D

What is ADVICE? View; opinion; the counsel given by lawyers to their clients; an opinion expressed as to wisdom of future conduct The instruction usually given by one merchant or banker to another by letter, informing him of shipments made to him, or of bills or drafts drawn on him, with particulars of date, or sight, the sum, and the payee. Bills presented for acceptance or payment are frequently dishonored for icant of advice.

What is REMITTANCE? Money sent by one person to another, either in specie, bill of ex- change, check, or otherwise.

Cash, credit card, check are all instruments that are a "promise to pay at a future date and time".

So, someone presents me with a BILL. I ask for advice (instruction on BILL) on the REMITTANCE. Without advice, I can dishonor the BILL. With advice?....They would instruct me on REMITTANCE? Which is money in specie, BoE, a check, or otherwise.

What is BILL OF EXCHANGE? A written order from A. to B., directing B. to pay to C. a certain sum of money therein named. Byles, Bills, 1. An open (that is, unsealed) letter addressed by one person to another directing him, in effect, to pay, absolutely and at all events, a certain sum of money therein named, to a third person, or to any other to whom that third person may order it to be paid, or it may be payable to bearer or to the drawer himself. 1 Daniel, Neg. Inst. 27. A bill of exchange is an instrument, negotiable in form, by which one, who is called the “drawer,” requests another, called the “drawee,” to pay a specified sum of money. Civil Code Cal.

What is DRAWER? The person making a bill of exchange and addressing it to the drawee.Stevenson v. Walton, 2 Smedes & M. (Miss.) 265; Winnebago County State Bank v.Hustel, 119 Iowa, 115, 93 N. W. 70.

So, I can make a Bill of Exchange to pay a BILL? or am I not following this?

I've been asking ADVICES to Hydro-Quebec 4 times now, via registered mail on HOW to deal this BoE they keep sending me, I'm asking them to REVEAL to me EVERY method available to me ..... COMPLETE SILENCE from their part... :-\

One full year has passed, I still have hydro, and the last BoE they've sent me was $3600

Is Hydro-Quebec a utility company? Water? Electric?

Silence = Acquiescence

Yes but on what ?.... Im just asking them questions...

How do you differentiate between a Bill of Exchange and an Invoice?

ha....good point.

Utility company for electricity

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/invoice

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/bill+of+exchange

ok.....so Hydro-Quebec sends you a Bill of Exchange. So, if they presented it to you, THEY are the Drawer, correct? They are thinking you are the Drawee, yes? Who then is the Payee? You as the Drawee say "Yes, it would be my pleasure to pay this third party (who is....?) on demand or at a future date, but how would you like me to do this?"

Do I have this correct? When you received the Bill of Exchange, how were you able to identify it as a BoE and not as a Bill for Account or Services (etc) or an Invoice?

This is EXACTLY what I'm asking them, in my letter I write: It seems to me that what you are sending me is a bill of exchange, since I don't see ANY invoice number no where on it... :D

So, because you can't find an invoice number (perhaps an account number?? though?), you are presuming it has to be a Bill of Exchange? Could it be anything else?

I don't know....that's why I'm asking them !....BUT THEY DON'T FUCKING ANSWER ME.... :D

An INVOICE need to have an INVOICE NUMBER on it.....no choices

It should probably state "INVOICE" also....Could it be something else? Did you sign a contract?

No, I haven't signed a contract, electricity is a NO CHOICE utility

And plus, Hydro-Quebec is ownes by US, the people :D

? You are required to have electricity whether you want it or not?

So the electricity that goes through the wires is MINE.... :D

Held in Public Trust is what you are saying, yes?

HQ is the Trustee of that Trust, yes?

Hydro-Quebec can ONLY invoice corporation, and they can only send BoE to the people and wish these people will BUY that debt and pay for it :D

Of course!!!! And they MISTAKENLY thought you were acting as a corporation and not as a Beneficiary!

This finally makes sense. Now, how can I tell if I get a BoE or if it is some other thing?

No, they are doing what they have to do......and the Government taught us through School on what to know and, more importantly, on what to NOT know... :D

They are sending BoE to ignorant people that can't see what they are receiving

But, how do we know they are BoE's?

We are so fucking ignorant, it's an OBVIOUS scheme

You ask them Chris Schulte,

LMAO....and when they don't answer. HAHAHAAH!

You WRITE to them and send via REGISTERED mail, and OBLIGE them to answer you

mhmmmmm......

If they DON't answer, then it becomes OBVIOUS that you've pressed a embarassing BUTTON

I want to become the MOST top gun specialist in PRESSING embarassing BUTTONS

I want to be number one in Canada in this field....

And I want to do it with: RESPECT, HONOUR, DIGNITY and INTEGRITY

Now, I can't wait to see how much respect, honour, dignity and integrity our public servant have.....let see that :)

Ok....I just read my Electricity Agreement. I signed this 7 years ago and haven't thought of it since. I identified myself with an SSN. This would mean I identified myself as a "corporate fiction". Thereby, I would be required to pay them. Looks like I need to change this contract and let them know I have no duty to provide them with this number pursuant to the Privacy Act of 1974. More fun!!!!!!

Then after my account is closed out and my new one is open. When I receive my first "BILL", I ask if this is a BoE.

You identified the PERSON that will receice these bill of exchange....

ahhhh..yes. good point!

It dosen't matter....you can ask questions ANY time you want,,,what's wrong in asking questions ? :/

Ok. I will go the Pierre route. I have a Bill here due on 7/26. I will write to them and ask them.

This is where we get fucked big time.....people are AFFRAID to ask questions....this is where I focus on my children education, I reapet them EVERYDAY......ASK ANY FREAKING QUESTIONS THAT CROSS YOUR MIND.....Always and to ANYONE...

You have a BoE act in USA ?

IDK Bildo?

And now, I will buy for all my children a red ink VOID stamp :D

I've blocked Dildo as well :/

Care to elaborate?>

on what ?

Pierre blocked me after we did some role playing. I can't see what he posts.

Am I the only American you haven't blocked?

LOL

Wanted me to apologize for putting him in a pickle. I refused.

When someone makes me angry and they don't want to admit that they were wrong, I block them....virtualy and in real life as well... :D

And when it happened, I did not found love and seen the light at the end of the tunnel at that time :D

Scott Duncan, I found nothing on a BoE Act in the United States or in Massachusetts.....any advice? Maybe its in the UCC, lemme check....

I am thinking that this is it....

http://www.law.cornell.edu/ucc/3/article3.htm#s3-101

Check this out with freezebee and dildo :D

Remember, INdorsing is different than ENdorsing.

Scott Duncan will know. I am sure he will like it or correct me!

cuz all Americans are sovereign in usa use UCC

endorse (indorse) v. 1) to sign one's name to the back of a check, bill of exchange or other negotiable instrument with the intention of making it cashable or transferable. 2) to pledge support to a program, proposal, or candidate. (See; endorsement)

TO INDORSE. To write on the back. Bills of exchange and promissory notes are indorsed by the party writing his name on the back; writing one's name on the back of a writ, is to indorse such writ. 7 Pick. 117. See 13 Mass. 396.

did i miss something?

Yeah John, I a thinking that too....but UCC is clubhouse rules. yes?

The man chooses when he uses his legal person to do business with his ability to make contract or not make contract the only right

Here's one: Endorsed=Received. Indorsed=backed by your "signature".

hmmmm.....and what are the circumstances in which they are different?

Remember a right is something that cannot be taken away

There is no government agency going to say that I cannot act as.(JOHN WADE FRISBEY) To conduct business affairs

You can act however you want, but you can never avoid the consequences.

My legal person is the insurance for the man

endorse remittances? ...indorse a promissory note?

REMITTANCE, comm. law. Money sent by one merchant to another, either in specie, bill of exchange, draft or otherwise.

Gail Blackman, 3 parties to BoE....what if ?

Me = Drawer Bank of Canada = Drawee The one who sent me the BoE = Third party or Me = Drawer Receveur General du Canada = Drawee The one who sent me the BoE = Third party

ahhhh....yes....they are asking you to tell someone to pay them. Very well could be!

So the one who are sending me these BoE are just starting the BoE, for me to complete it, and send it to the Drawee, which is either the Bank of Canada or The Receveur General (I'm not sure of these 2) and then one of these 2 have to send it to the third party, which is the one who sent me that bill in the first place ?

Scott Duncan please can you tell me if I think right here ?

that is pretty much how it's worked out for my dentist bill...so we'll see the outcome of that.

Where have you sent it again ? (sorry, cracking skull issues here :( )

Bank of Canada

Shit..!!!! :-D

originally I was going to have him send it to the Bank of Canada...but he wasn't sure what to do etc..and said he'd have to speak with his lawyer blah blah...would I do it.

You've done EXACTLY the right thing the way I get it... :-D

FFS, I'm I going to start doing BoE :D

But who will REALLY pay for all these BoE ? Other people that still sleeping ? :(

Mmmmhhhh.....

If you send to the receiver general, the payment is taken from the consolidated revenue fund which is tax money... a little birdy told Derek Moran that there is only one institution in canada that can create money from our valuable consideration/signature...the Bank of Canada

Ha HA !!!!.....

And in the States, the Federal Reserve

In Canada, what does the Receiver General have to do with the Bank of Canada?

Mind your own business Chris Schulte, or move to Canada :D

Move to Quebec, we will have a bit of fun together :D

Fuck off and tell me so I can translate

I was fishing with a guy from Montreal last weekend on Cape Cod. he was a "Currency Exchanger"

I don't know if the receiver general has anything to do with the bank of canada...the deptuy minister of finance sits on the board of the bank of canada although doesnt have a vote...I think the receiver general is more tied to revenue canada?

http://is.muni.cz/elportal/estud/praf/ps06/bills/materialy/files/obr17b.gif

what does the Receiver General do?

They receive

:D

taxes?

TAXES

Ok...gotcha

Bill of Exchange

In Montreal, February 31st 2013

For this bill of exchange pay to the order of Fucks the Puppy the sum of $100 CDN

Drawee: Bank of Canada

Fucks the Dumpy SIN: XXX-XXX-XXX (signature of the DRAWER)

And in Australia the Reserve Bank of Australia.

OK, but following my thinking process, humm, by doing it with the bank of canada, we are creating more and more debts ?

Which seems to be a wrong thing to do ? :/

Any thoughts ?

Would it exist ANOTHER option ?

I think that you would tell the TRUSTEE of the Public Trust.

Because it should be paid out of that fund

Mmmhhh...!!!

The only problem with taking it out of the Public trust is that it harms others by increasing public (government) debt, which your fellow man pays for...even though this is the way we are instructed to do it via the B of E Act (at least in Australia, the instruction is to send it via the state treasury).

My understanding is that if it gets sent to the central bank (who creates the currency in the first place, they can discharge it at their end, or make the necessary deposit on our behalf...which is why people with a greater comprehension than me have done it this way.

Either way, more debt is created, which ultimately burdens and or enslaves us further, which leaves us in a Catch 22 because until we can get everyone out of this debt based system, ultimately someone 'innocent' ends up harmed by our actions.

You just write all the noise my brain was trying to spit out :D

Yes....that is exactly what I was discussing with Bildo Schmildo earlier. So, if we are beneficiaries of the Public Trust and we are sent a BoE, maybe we shouldn't be doing anything with it.....maybe there is something else all together we are missing.....

The way it is set up in America (although it got all fucked up with the 14th Amendment) is indirect and apportioned taxes to cover this stuff. For example...Gasoline Tax pays for Infrastructure. It would be perfect if we weren't bought by "benefits"

There must be a further remedy that doesn't harm others by our actions...or the system, by its very design is inherently evil

Corporate Income Tax pays for defense....it really seemed simple.

Yes....gotta be!

This all happened here because corporations didn't wanna pay tax...I suspect that is the same everywhere. But we let them on our land through our Public Trust.......

It's all about SURETY and ACCOUNTING :)

Not that I want to steal freezebee's spot by parroting Scott, but that is what gets out of all this.... :D

gets who out of what?

My brain :D

I'm sorry... Your WHAT? :D

Well...the protoplasm thing up there :D

Who is Liable to being called to account for the Surety of the PERSON ? :D

Not me, fuck that :D

http://www.uncitral.org/uncitral/en/uncitral_texts/payments/1988Convention_bills_promissory.html

So Scott, I am understanding any BILL that you receive that has a REMITTANCE attached would show that it is a PUBLIC DEBT? Therefore can only be "paid" with MONEY OF ACCOUNT?

Very good question......That is also how I am understanding it.

Not sure if I understand correctly but, the bill portion would be the part that gets discharged against the public debt, and the remittance is what is owed the beneficiary of the trust being manged as part of our birthright to the resources of the land, is this close Scott Duncan? Or am I way off base on this?

I think the remittance is how to pay it. Basically an unendorsed cheque.

Remittance is compliance with advice on how to discharge.

But a BILL with a REMITTANCE would be understood as PUBLIC DEBT?

so the question is how to discharge?

I think you have to ask them for ADVICE on the REMITTANCE Derek Hill...Then discharge accordingly

Ask who Chris Schulte? The Corporation, Gov, CRA...?

whoever sends it to u

My cable bill says "Make cheque Payable to Cogeco Canada." Right there on the face. It does not say make your cheque. Make cheque Payable. And bloody'ell it certainly looks like a cheque. So when we get our corrected bill back we are going to Accepted by signature on the back and put the B.C. number. Just to see what happens. We have switched to phone data and canceled the cable.

Chad Brodgesell, here is how I did it:

ACCEPTED BY:____________________

DATE:___________________

Account Number: (I put my SIN)

(signature)

Bill of exchange act L.R.C. (1985)

And I sent it back to the them, but I should have sent it to the Bank of Canada (original) and send them (which are the third party) a copy and a note saying that Bank of Canada will take care of this... :D

But so far, it looks like it worked anyway :D

The way I get it Chad is , I am the DRAWER, the Bank of Canada is the DRAWEE, and these guys who send us these BoE are the third party.

They just commence these BoE for us because we have NO CLUE on what is going on, and we will certainly BUY BACK these debts by sending them a check :D

I know for a fact that this is TRUE, because I ASKED four times Hydro-Quebec about it via refistered mail and they DON'T answer me, they just stay silent, and they don't come to my house to cut the service, They don't even call me :/

Interest info Pete Daoust. But would the drawer not be the party sending the bill of exchange (unless it is incomplete) and the drawee be the Government as legal title holder of PETE DAOUST?

Pete Daoust thanks. Why he SIN though and not the BC.?? Doesn't using the SIN designate from an Employee??

The SIN is the account number of PIERRE DAOUST Chad Brodgesell, and PIERRE DAOUST is not me, if they want to presume it's one of there emplyee, it's their business, not mine.....I AM NOT one of their employee...

James Allan, that's what I've thought 3 days ago, but I REALLY think that I AM the drawer, Hydro-Quebec just help me by starting the bill, because they have no other choices....Hydro-Quebec is the THIRD PARTY, and as far as the drawee, you can pick either the Bank of Canada or Receveur General du Canada, I pick the Bank of Canada because they will CREATE some money of account to discharge the bill, if I pick Receveur General of Canada, they will take some of my neighbor's taxes to pay the bill....

It's a catch 22 :D

how does one do business with out the legal person they don't

I am NOT a legal person I HAVE a legal person that I can choose to do business with under my WILL of power of attorney.

Hydro-Quebec is the THIRD PARTY, but they can't count on me to make the BoE because I'm suppose to be an IGNORANT, so they just started it, and send it to me, and because I'm suppose to be a stupid ignorant, they ASSUME that I will BUY BACK that debt :D

They have no CLUE that I can learn stuff :D

So now, I say: Hey, thanks HQ for starting that BoE for me, and now watch me ACCEPT, SIGN, DATE and complete that stupid BoE and send it REGISTERED MAIL to the Bank of Canada (Drawee) so they can send some Money of Account to HQ (Third Party)

Chad Brodgesell, you can use either the SIN or the BC number....it makes no difference, they are all connected anyway

How's that soud James Allan ? :D

Or perhaps most people simply claim, by their conduct, to be the legal title holder for the NAME and government, having best evidence of legal title to the NAME, simply take no issue with your claim and is more than happy to let you deal with the bills they are actually liable for?

Oh and Chad Brodgesell, I am NOT using the SIN in this operation, THEY are using it, not me.....me I'm just doing the RIGHT thing concerning the PERSON I have, that's all, I am doing NO wrong in all this, I just DECIDE to NOT buy debt.

There is two choices with BoE.

1). You buy back the debt (I did that for the past 30 years)

2). You ACCEPT the BoE and send it to the Drawee so he can DISCHARGE it.

No other options available, unless there is another one hidden somewhere :D

They ALWAYS send thes BoE to the PERSON, never to ME.

But is the bill not in the name of PETE DAOUST? Who has legal title to that name?

And who are the Government's BANK ?

Is the owner (party having legal title) of the NAME not liable for its bills?

Where is the government's BANK ?

I well do as Scott Duncan Has taught me to do because. Scott Duncan is always right

Who took the original signed copy of the Statement of Birth and who is presently the holder of same? Is that not the best evidence of title to the NAME? HAve you ever tried to get that document from the Government?

Not working that smoothly for me. I have done the same thing here and have had not one remittances accepted.

I'm sure this document James Allan is sitting somewhere at THE BANK OF CANADA :D

Todd Keller, you have done the EXACT same thing ?

Remittance accepted ? :/

Did you do a perfected lien on the birth certificate?

If you are looking for the ORIGINAL BC James, I suggest to address Bank of Canada :-D

By doing a perfected lien on your property removing it from the control of the Government of Canada are any other country you then place it into your corporation which you then have sole control over

FUUUUUUUCCCCCCKKKKKKKK!

? :/

Thanks Pete Daoust, further clarifying the process for me...I'm still waiting for responses on mine :D

Everything's OK Chris Schulte ? :/

I just don't get it! Period. I HAVE WAAAAAY more questions than answers. The more answers I get seem to lead to more fucking questions. I am EXTREMELY frustrated and about 34 seconds from having a French Canadian style meltdown!

LOL...what is your FIRST question ?

First part please :D

Can we just have one fucking discussion without INSANE ramblings so I can fucking learn something here? And can I get a FULL DISCLOSURE on anything?

LOL :D....first part of your question please

Check that....I require WHOLE DISCLOSURE

"ME", I can't see anymore posts from: freezebee, dildo and no equal, so I am OK :D

first part of your question please :D

<sigh>

Hey, Chris Schulte, watch that 10 seconds video :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRnT-AU7ToQ

HAHAHAHA!!!!!

Chris, first part of your question please :(

Nevermind... :-( I need a break

Listen to RUSH, Limelight :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwXjnVICb3I

Living on a lighted stage Approaches the unreal For those who think and feel In touch with some reality Beyond the gilded cage.

Cast in this unlikely role, Ill-equipped to act, With insufficient tact, One must put up barriers To keep oneself intact.

Living in the Limelight, The universal dream For those who wish to seem. Those who wish to be Must put aside the alienation, Get on with the fascination, The real relation, The underlying theme.

Living in a fisheye lens, Caught in the camera eye. I have no heart to lie, I can't pretend a stranger Is a long-awaited friend.

All the world's indeed a stage, And we are merely players, Performers and portrayers, Each another's audience Outside the gilded cage.

remittance advice. Notice that a sum of money has been sent (esp. by mail) for goods or services...

^ What does that mean?

Scott Duncan- Remittance is compliance with advice on how to discharge.

So I looked up remittance advice in Black's...

I have NO IDEA :D

This is what is confusing the fuck out of me. If I ask for ADVICE on the REMITTANCE. then comply, why the fuck would I issue a Notice of that?

So to "ME", it means ASKING the person who sent you this bill of exchange on HOW to remit :D

see how frustrating this is?

Is "ME" Pete Daoust? PIERRE DAOUST? or who?

I have DONE that 4 times with one BoE, and no answer so far :D

Advice - Notice of the drawing of a draft for goods or services.

"ME" is "ME", you can use these names: Pierre Daoust, Pete, Peter, and Fucks the Puppy, but I would rather you use Pete... :D

PIERRE DAOUST is the NAME of the person I happen to have in my pocket :D

ADVICE, com. law. A letter containing information of any circumstances unknown to the person to whom it is written; when goods are forwarded by sea or land, the letter transmitted to inform the consignee of the fact, is termed advice of goods, or letter of advice. When one merchant draws upon another, he generally advises him of the fact. These letters are intended to give notice of the facts they contain.

You can ask for ADVICES from the PERSON, COMPANY or ANYONE that will send you a bill of exchange on HOW to proceed with the fucking thing, ask them what are your OPTIONS with this thing, they HAVE to answer you.....tell them the call is recorded for training purpose, or send them your questions via registered mail...

So remittance is the sum of money sent between parties and advice is the notice sent to confirm the money being exchanged...?

Sorry if I'm confusing you more Chris. I've just jumped in on this thread and am only putting it together myself...

You ask for ADVICES on HOW to remit....

REMITTANCE, comm. law. Money sent by one merchant to another, either in specie, bill of exchange, draft or otherwise.

Another question is why does Scott never enter these discussions and why did he say he doesn't support this to Gail before?

My advice to ...well.. any one who wants to hear it is, Read Black's Law 4th or 5th edition. Just skim it. Some words will jump out, focus on those and each word in the definition. Then go on to the next. Over and over again. Make the one dictionary (which ever you pick) the only book you read for 2 months at least. Spend every waking moment not involved with the life and family reading that one book. After that you will naturally gravitate to other documents yadda yadda.

If you receive a bill of exchange for instance from the government, regarding income taxes let say, you can send a letter to the government asking them WHAT ARE the options for me to DEAL with this thing, other than FIDUCIARY money, or bank notes.

They HAVE to respond to you, and they HAVE to tell you the truth...

Scott - I'm NOT one of you idiots who don't read their contracts. I'm NOT one of you freeloaders-on-the-land who don't want to pay their bills.

Your questions is in good faith, If I have NO OTHER CHOICE to pay with bank notes, I will pay with Bank Notes, but if there is other options, I NEED to know and they HAVE to tell me :D

He also said something else about the government stealing that money and if we use it, we are contributing to the fraud....

Scott Duncan usually just gets pissed off with these discussions they are not focused on learning/teaching the matter at hand.

OK, but FIRST THING FIRST, I need to know ALL the options on what to do with this bill of exchange.....lets start with this :D

What is the matter at hand Chad?

Also all this stuff has already been posted in other threads.

The matter is if we use this method to pay our bills, either someone else (ignorant) will end up paying for us, or NEW DEBT will be created....

I've tried mine with the bank of canada, so NEW DEBTS will be created instead of someone else paying....but I don't like that either......catch 22 type of thing

Well Chad this thread here begins with : I'm working on discharging some debt...... :D

That is the POINT. what specifically is the MATTER at hand? General question receive general responses there by confusing the matter even worse.

I am NOT confused.....for now :D

WHAT DEBT? Many types of DEBT.

You see ? I'm confused now :D....many TYPES of debts ? :/

I have a DEBT to my wife that requires me to get down and bury my face. The method of discharging that as compared to discharging a bill from COGECO CABLE are completely different.

My point is some one asks for help on how to do some thing but does not give the particulars of the mattet.

Matter. Sry

Oh....there is YOUR debt, and CHAD BRODGESELL's debts

chad being a funny guy today

YOURSELF is not CHAD BRODGESELL

-sigh-

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10200333134517972&set=gm.543250709044199&type=1&theater

Read that !!!!

I have, the other day Pete I even saved the thread. WHAT has THAT got to do WITH a poster NOT posting the PARTICULARS of their request?

The ORG are not registering PEOPLE (Humans) they are registering PERSON's......The ORG is responsable for ANY debts incured by YOURSELF....who is YOURSELF ?....

Forget it....I am not gonna get this shit. I quit!

oh yes you will.....

nope...done

you can call me Chris my numbers 18 105 88 1920

It's easy :D

Thanks Frisbey, but I am done with this topic....It doesn't make any sense what-so-ever

“negotiable instrument” includes any cheque, draft, traveller’s cheque, bill of exchange, postal note, money order, postal remittance and any other similar instrument;

Rule H6 (s) "Remittance" means the portion of an Invoice that conforms to Part II of this Rule, or the electronic data, that is submitted to the Payor's FI by the Payor along with payment, and which itself becomes a credit item representing value when subsequently Exchanged by the Payor's FI;

I think the banker endorses them for the credit but they keep your money anyways...

the remittance is the piece of paper that you tear off of your bill statement that you turn in and make money by discharge of that buck O five

the company must first offer you which format of payment are discharged you choose to do they are asking for your advice on what to do with it

you can either pay with that instrument which is Federal Reserve's which is a legal and constitutional law are you can discharge debt with lawful tender are lawful money which is a postage stamp of $1 this is lawful currency and valuable consideration

I spent 3 hours with a crazy Australian last night discussing this whole matter of discharge of dabt

I just want to share my value with you all

I don't care about what you discussed with a crazy Australlian Frisbey. I am looking for fucking HARD EVIDENCE. As in SOLID PROOF.

Where is REMITTANCE defined as COUPON on the bottom of a BoE?

Have you ever voted?

why would they give up the secret

Black`s 9th coupon (koo-pon). An interest or dividend certificate that is attached to another instrument, such as a bond, and that may be detached and separately presented for payment of a definite sum at a specified time.

everything is accounting so yes everything has a discharge because it needs a signature

yup as power of attorney you're supposed to know this stuff

Whats a cig?

tube filled with tobacco.

signature

Frisbey, a.) what the fuck does any of that mean? b.) Prove it....

look at my profile pic right those damn stamps down you can do it and read and instead of a stamp

I'm going to use them on electric bill you'll see

Yeah whatever....if you can't explain to me in terms I understand, then you don't understand it. Simple

you can use just the red ink pen instead of a stamp. you will still need a $1 postage stamp and a five cents postage stamp

I'm going to take a before and after picture of my remittance which I turn into a bill of exchange

everytime I try to explain Facebook text me off so just wait

study what the words mean on the stamps I have on my profile picture